Clutch Broke With Only 11k Miles, Dealer Blamed Me.

"SteveLehto" (stevelehto)
08/20/2014 at 13:00 • Filed to: repairs, clutch

The clutch on my brand new Dodge Dart went with only 11k miles on it. I've owned plenty of manual transmission vehicles and I don't abuse them. But the dealer said that I have to pay for the replacement. What should I do?

This question was submitted to Car Buying and I gave the answer below. Read on and see what happened . . .

From dealing with similar problems for countless clients over 23 years of doing !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , I can tell you some basics. "Wear items" (clutches, brakes etc) are always going to raise a red flag on warranty claims. The best bet is for the customer to present his case as calmly as possible and, when he can, point out that he knows how to drive a clutch. IF his claim is denied (and it might not be) he then needs to elevate the claim CALMLY. With Chrysler, the next step is the Zone Rep, the mysterious factory/Chrysler rep who acts as liaison between the manufacturer and the dealer (remember: the dealer sold the car and could do the repairs - Chrysler is who we hope will pay for them

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The Zone Rep has the power to override any claim denial and sometimes will even do it just for the sake of good will (meaning he might still think you smoked the clutch doing burnouts in front of the local junior high but chooses to disregard it). The dealers will not normally give this person's contact info out but they CAN tell you when s/he will be there next (they usually visit each dealer periodically) and can set you up with an appointment.

If you get that appointment, be polite, dress nice and present your case as calmly as possible. Explain that you know how to drive a clutch. The ZR might approve the repair. He might not. But he might also approve some sort of split. They provide parts, you pay for labor. Something like that. If s/he makes that offer then you have to weigh:

1) Value of goodwill repair discount versus

2) Value of suing for breach of warranty and the odds of winning, cost of waiting for an outcome etc etc.

You'd be surprised. Acting calmly and professionally goes a long way. Keep in mind that the dealer WANTS to repair it under warranty (Chrysler pays them). It's just that Chrysler will ask them for the pertinent info such as mileage at the time of failure. If you are nice at all levels, then it is more likely that the dealer will help you pitch the case to the ZR.

Good luck.

. . .

I received a note about this last night. Following my advice, the car buyer got 2/3 of the bill paid for him as "goodwill" and only had to pay 1/3 of the bill from his own pocket.

And notice: No one was sued in the making of this story.

(Photo Credit: Getty Images)

Steve Lehto has been practicing consumer protection and !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! for 23 years in Michigan. He taught Consumer Protection at the University of Detroit Mercy School of Law for ten years and wrote !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! . He also wrote !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! and !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! both published by Chicago Review Press. Follow him on Twitter while Twitter is still a thing. Twitter : !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!!

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DISCUSSION (100)

Ark > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:04

Even at 1/3 of the cost he still got robbed. Unless he spent 11k miles doing burnouts up and down the road there is no reason to need a clutch that early except flawed manufacturing.

nafsucof > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:08

have it towed to another dealer?? What are the reasons that they say the clutch failed?

SteveLehto > Ark
08/20/2014 at 13:09

Yes, but the point here is that this falls into a gray area. He'd say he never did those things and they'd say he did. They'd have their mechanics testify (if it got to court) and the jury would then pick a winner. Confident you will win?

This is a better outcome than he was looking at before and most likely better than suing (which would have required him to foot the bill for the repair and then try to sue to get the money back a year or two from now).

SteveLehto > nafsucof
08/20/2014 at 13:10

He's looking for repairs under the manufacturer's warranty. It wouldn't matter where you tow it. They all ask Chrysler to authorize the repairs. Once the first visit is logged in the system Chrysler knows the vehicle is out there with a bad clutch.

nafsucof > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:15

gotcha...didn't know if a second option was a thing with this stuff.

thebigbossyboss > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:17

Thanks!

SteveLehto > nafsucof
08/20/2014 at 13:19

The takeaway from this is that he got a better result by being businesslike than he would have by being all "I'm going to sue you!" Obviously, he could have sued them and possibly gotten a better result somewhere way down the road. WAY down.

All Motor Is Best Motor > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:20

I drive a car equipped with an early 2000's Honda automatic transmission. The very same transmission that can be found in an early 2000's Accord. Yes, that transmission . The one that cost Honda/Acura millions of dollars and through lawsuits, forced them to extend the warranty on the transmission and issue a massive recall. I had my first one replaced under the recall and everything went fine. ~17,000 miles later (at around 89,000 miles) the replacement went bust! They never really did completely iron out the issues these transmissions had (mainly a crappy 2-3 gear clutch pack and extremely high running temps). Since the car was no longer under warranty I had to argue for days with the Acura ZR until we finally came to an agreement that they would replace the second transmission and I would pay for labor only. I got lucky with the deal I got, but I'm certain if this third trans goes they're going to smile and say "better luck next time." Think I will be completely out of luck? The car is now at 111,000 miles so I'm thinking yes since the car isn't under warranty.

SteveLehto > thebigbossyboss
08/20/2014 at 13:22

Unlinked - although there was no way anyone could know it was him (or you for that matter). Thanks for the note (and passing along my info).

thebigbossyboss > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:25

Thanks.

deekster_caddy > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:25

If any clutch went at 11K though - there was something wrong with the install (factory), or the clutch had a defect. Yeah, it's a wear item, but even under duress it should far outlast 11K. If a brake pad fails because the pad material fell off, I would be looking for a warranty pad replacement. There's no mention of why the clutch failed, or what the dealer found when they were looking at the old parts. An 11K clutch failure should involve more diagnosis.

The diagnosis might result in "we found evidence of abuse", but more likely it should find a problem - clutch return spring defective, clutch material defective, clutch slave cylinder improperly bled... something!

We bought a brand new Passat Wagon in '08 and I taught my wife to drive stick on it. There were many many instances of 'abuse' to that clutch from a new stick driver during the first 10K miles on it. If it smoked in 30K miles, I wouldn't have complained. That car has almost 100K on it now and it's STILL on the original clutch.

FrederickLawOlmsteez > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:27

Why no mention of inspecting the actual clutch plate? A lot can be learned from what the surface of the clutch looks like. As Ark mentioned, he still got robbed for paying 1/3.

SteveLehto > All Motor Is Best Motor
08/20/2014 at 13:27

Probably out of luck in the future but you're still doing okay. There are often these scenarios where manufacturers know of problems which will hit after warranty. In many states (Welcome to Michigan!) the companies have no obligation the second the warranty expires. BUT, you can often seek goodwill as described above. I have spoken with many people who had done this or did this as I talked them through it. Doesn't always work but often does.

FrederickLawOlmsteez > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:28

How does the dealership reconcile this 1/3 - 2/3 split with the Chrysler? This sounds like complete bullshit. Is there a chance the stealership got a full reimbursement from Chrysler and 1/3 cash from the sucker — err, customer?

TheCraigy > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:33

Yeah I agree practically speaking it's a good result.

However if I was the Dart owner I'd be pissed that not only it broke after 11k, but also I had to go to all of the trouble in the first place and finally I had to pay part of the bill. I'd never buy another mopar again.

1234567890-- > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:36

All it should take is a mention, and maybe some evidence, that you are a patriarch in firestorm social media. Use hot-words like that, while assuring them that you are preparing a 5000 word rant post that will be seen by a trillion people.

SteveLehto > deekster_caddy
08/20/2014 at 13:37

All I can tell you is that someone posed the question and I gave an answer. Everything you are saying is true and if this was me (or you) those questions would need to be asked. I can tell you, however, that sometimes dealers don't like those types of questions and will deny a claim if you ask too many of them.

SteveLehto > FrederickLawOlmsteez
08/20/2014 at 13:38

If I had to guess, it's one party paid for parts and the other party paid for labor or something like that. All I had to go on was the question which was passed to me (as it reads above) and the answer I gave (above).

erikgrad > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:38

When the manufacturers makes a goodwill offer of this nature, do they require the customer to sign any sort of waiver?

I am just curious if a customer could pursue the balance of coverage through litigation later, particularly if a widespread manufacturing defect becomes obvious (which I think may be happening with the clutch on Dodge Dart, based on many internet forums discussing it)

SteveLehto > TheCraigy
08/20/2014 at 13:40

I can tell you countless stories (but I won't!) of consumers who had a bad experience with one brand and never bought that brand again. Even after owing 10 or 15 of those brand cars in a row. Or a guy who WORKED for a Big Three MFR and got screwed by THEM.

SteveLehto > 1234567890--
08/20/2014 at 13:42

I once had a dealership guy (tech, mechanic, writer? I have no idea which) tell me a blatant lie about "the law." I was wearing jeans and a t-shirt. YES, I handed him my card and asked him if he wanted to actually discuss "the law" with me. I know - a dick move - but just once a year or so you gotta do it.

SteveLehto > erikgrad
08/20/2014 at 13:43

I am not aware of any waivers in these situations but nothing would surprise me. The real question is the cost of litigating for the value of 1/3 the repair bill. Then again, maybe a class action . . . . . hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Ark > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:46

So they're going to rape you one way or another, but it'll be worse if you try to fight it?

Ugh. Dealers are the worst.

Ark > deekster_caddy
08/20/2014 at 13:48

To be realistic, the diagnosis will result in whatever the manager tells the tech they want the diagnosis to be. If you come up with an answer that results in the dealer eating the cost of a clutch replacement, don't be surprised if you find yourself fired for some trumped-up reason in the near future.

SteveLehto > Ark
08/20/2014 at 13:50

Well, the point is that you might get a decent offer it you play nice at first. If you don't like that offer then weigh the possibility of fighting on. The world is filled with people who fought righteous battles and lost.

With an item like a clutch or brakes etc, the MFR will often second guess the dealer and make the call. Most dealers WANT to make these repairs under warranty. They get paid to do them. So for the claim to be denied most likely means that someone at Chrysler flagged it.

Dar > deekster_caddy
08/20/2014 at 13:52

We did essentially the same thing in 2000 when we bought our Impreza RS. The clutch went out at 33K miles and Subaru replaced the clutch, the throwout bearing, and the pressure plate all under warranty. Some stories do have a happy ending!

Ark > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 13:58

Yeah, tell me about it. I used to be a dealer tech. Manufacturers take a certain sadistic pleasure in nitpicking warranty claims and finding reasons to deny them and dump the cost back on the dealer. I doubt the Chrysler warranty guy looked beyond the word "clutch".

In my experience, though, dealers and techs definitely prefer customer pay jobs. Warranty rates are atrocious, and it's extremely difficult to break even on your time by just doing warranty work. Also, if a dealer submits too many warranty claims, they can look forward to the manufacturer sending an auditor out to dig through their records and try to recoup the money by finding more reasons to deny claims. I've been on the receiving end of that process...yuck. It is definitely in the dealership's best interest and the tech's best interest to stick the customer with the bill, at customer-pay rates.

Will Drink For Good Kinja > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 14:00

Step one: Go back in time. Step two: Don't buy a Dodge Dart.

SteveLehto > Ark
08/20/2014 at 14:01

Interesting. This may vary from MFR to MFR also. I know that if I had an 18 year old kid in front of me with a several thousand dollar repair, I'd rather have the MFR pay it. How many times did you quote some huge job to a customer and have then tell you to "wait" while they went looking for funding?

Will Drink For Good Kinja > deekster_caddy
08/20/2014 at 14:01

There's a reason Volkswagen has more cars on the road over 100k miles than any other manufacturer despite only having 4% of the market. Other cars are manufactured, Volkswagens are engineered.

SteveLehto > Will Drink For Good Kinja
08/20/2014 at 14:05

Everything is easier if we get to go back in time. I often joke with my friends that my life would be so much simpler if everyone would call me right BEFORE they screwed up. "Steve? I'm about to get in my car and drive home from the bar. My BAC is .4. Yes, not .04 but .4%" Or, "I'm about to give cash to a guy for a car - he promises he'll give me the title tomorrow."

Ark > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 14:17

It does vary a lot from dealer to dealer. I worked for several over my (short) career. Most service writers did behave like actual human beings and would submit warranty work if the customer had a reasonable claim. Repeat customers often got cut some slack on warranty jobs if they thought it would make them come back and buy another car in a few years. Just because customer pay is in the dealer's best interest, that doesn't mean every service writer was willing to burn bridges in pursuit of quick money.

High price tags definitely scare people off. As a tech, you have to weigh your desire to sell more work against the likelihood of the customer throwing their arms up and saying "I can't afford to do anything right now". It sucks handing people huge repair bills, but there is constant pressure from management (and your own dwindling paycheck) to sell more work. On the tech's side, the ugly truth about warranty work is that if you spend all day doing recalls and warranty, you're taking home significantly less pay than the hours you're working. The service writers often like to play favorites with that kind of thing. Their favorite tech gets the customer pay jobs that let him bank 70 hours for the week, and the techs on the shit list bank 4 hours a day because they're replacing rusted Kia subframes under warranty rates that pay half the time it actually takes.

There is a lot of financial incentive to be aggressive with selling and compromise your honesty, and there is a tangible cost to being honest and nice. It sucks, and it's the reason I finally decided to GTFO.

1234567890-- > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 14:20

So you actually have some clout when speaking in terms of law? Pass the BAR?

SteveLehto > 1234567890--
08/20/2014 at 14:22

These two sentences are true: "Steve Lehto has been practicing consumer protection and lemon law for 23 years in Michigan. He taught Consumer Protection at the University of Detroit Mercy School of Law for ten years ."

The Bar I am admitted to is Michigan.

Dusty Ventures > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 14:28

I'd be impressed and a bit terrified by anyone that coherent at .4%

SteveLehto > Dusty Ventures
08/20/2014 at 14:29

Which is probably why they never call!

ncasolowork2 > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 14:46

Being polite anywhere in dealing with any issue with any company is good advice. Yelling is reserved for the special kind of stupid. You know what I'm talking about. The dealership who let the tech take your car home for the weekend for extended reliability testing and wouldn't tell you where the car was. That kind of stupid.

ncasolowork2 > Dusty Ventures
08/20/2014 at 14:55

I had a friend who went to Michigan State. She got one of those breathelyzers you can get online and got what I believe is a pretty good one. I think she once hit .42. I think 8 hours later she was still at .28. It is a wonder she didn't end up in the hospital.

CaptainWompus > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:05

Why don't they just look at tread wear? If he was allegedly doing these burnouts that he claims he wasn't doing, wouldn't the amount of remaining tread left in relation to the rated mileage come into play at some point?

SteveLehto > CaptainWompus
08/20/2014 at 15:14

Again, a good question I do not know the answer to.

I think it would be possible to damage a clutch through misuse in ways other than doing hole shots or burnouts. A truly incompetent operator could probably mess one up in 11,000 miles without leaving any evidence.

I wasn't given enough info to delve into all the possibilities. I was asked the question and gave an answer. The thought here is that readers might be able to glean something from this for their own use someday.

Mr. Sinister > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:18

My experience with Chrylser and warranty work is pretty poor, so I'm definitely hoping this works out for the guy.

oldirtybootz > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:18

Whose Dart was it? Was it the 1.4? The only clutch we've replaced so far was at over 40k. Mine has been fine in 17k.

SteveLehto > Mr. Sinister
08/20/2014 at 15:19

He had to pay part of the repair but he was happy with the result.

SteveLehto > oldirtybootz
08/20/2014 at 15:19

A reader of this site asked the question. All I have is the info in the question quoted above.

hismiths > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:20

I've played the zone rep card, also at a Chrysler dealer. After being stalled over several conversations, the mere mention of 'zone rep' (and the realization by the dealer that I even knew of the process) got my problem resolved.

DNLM > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:20

So what your saying is then pretend like your happy with the compromise and then completely bone them on their CSI scores later? (Just kidding)

Dar > Will Drink For Good Kinja
08/20/2014 at 15:21

*engineered poorly. ;)

heeltoehero > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:21

Seems to be a common Chrysler problem. My buddy's 2013 Wrangler Rubicon's clutch disc exploded at 3500 miles. They tried to blame it on him at first, but there was no way that he could have caused that failure. After a month and a half of fighting with them and being lied to about progress, and the car sitting waiting for parts, he got it back.

Between that and the fact that I had a flatbed drive tell me, as I was walking out of a dealership looking at a Challenger SRT8, that he hooks more brand new Chryslers and Dodges than any other brand, made me swear them off for good.

jimz > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:22

eep in mind that the dealer WANTS to repair it under warranty (Chrysler pays them).

not necessarily. I don't know if things have changed under FCA, but during the Dark Days of Daimler they weren't paying dealers shit for labor on warranty work.

SteveLehto > DNLM
08/20/2014 at 15:22

How many times can I recommend that comment?!

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > Ark
08/20/2014 at 15:24

"Manufacturers take a certain sadistic pleasure in nitpicking warranty claims and finding reasons to deny them and dump the cost back on the dealer. I doubt the Chrysler warranty guy looked beyond the word "clutch"."

SOME manufacturers more than others.

And from what I've been reading elsewhere, some manufacturers like Tesla do not do this.

SteveLehto > jimz
08/20/2014 at 15:24

What I meant is that often times it comes down to 1) Chrysler pays or 2) the customer takes it somewhere else where it will be cheaper or 3) the customer bumbles around for a while wondering if they can afford the repair. If nothing else, the Chrysler pays thing is sure money.

SteveLehto > heeltoehero
08/20/2014 at 15:26

I'll be curious to see if there are more of these out there. When something is platform wide, we usually hear about it.

Steve > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:27

so the moral of the story? don't buy a Italian owned dodge.

StevenG > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:27

Only 1/3rd? For something that is clearly a factory defect? I would be trading it in and swearing off the brand for live.

Mr. Sinister > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:27

Oy, somehow I missed that. Cannot brain today.

SteveLehto > StevenG
08/20/2014 at 15:28

Which also happens a lot. Still, 2/3ds is better than a pointy stick in the eye.

Turbineguy: Nom de Zoom > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:30

You'd think with only 11k miles, if it had been abused an inspection would provide evidence. Hot spots on the pressure plate, tire wear beyond that expected for 11k miles, melted rubber in the wheelwells.. I'd think it would be fairly obvious.

DipodomysDeserti > Ark
08/20/2014 at 15:31

Warranties are denied by the manufacturer, not the dealer.

PartyPooper2012 > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:32

You weren't supposed to touch it - Don't Touch My Dart!!!

mini4me > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:32

As you hint throughout the comments, also go to the internet boards, etc. and see if anyone else is having similar issues. The clutch on my mini burned out at around 20K and we had it replaced under warranty because (1) we showed that my wife and I both been driving manual cars for the previous 10 years, and (2) others were complaining of this problem all over the internet.

PatBateman > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:32

Steve, the most important part of your suggestion is to be calm and professional about the requests. Yelling at someone in a threatening manner (is there any other way to yell at someone?) will get you nowhere fast. Being nice, cordial, and respectful will get you more than the alternative 10 out of 10 times.

oldirtybootz > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:33

I try to keep up with all the fellow Dart owners here :)

Manwich - now Keto-Friendly > All Motor Is Best Motor
08/20/2014 at 15:33

"and extremely high running temps"

Install a bigger aftermarket transmission cooler with its own fan that you would normally get if you were towing a trailer. Then make sure you change out the transmission fluid according to the severe maintenance schedule... or maybe a little more frequently.

High running temps is what kills transmissions. Keep the temps in check and fluid fresh and it can do a lot for reliability/durability.

Arrivederci > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:34

Good advice Steve, thank you! At what point do you think you'd have no case on a clutch repair from manufacturing defect? 30k miles? 50k? I had a Miata that had the stock clutch at 120k and it still felt as strong as the day I bought the car used at 18k, so I know it clearly varies in application and driving style.

SteveLehto > PatBateman
08/20/2014 at 15:34

That, and recognizing that "No" might not be a final answer.

jimz > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:35

I guess my point was back then what little DCX was paying out for labor meant dealers were losing money on warranty work.

titsinmymitts > Ark
08/20/2014 at 15:35

Yea, warranty work has to pay like shit.

I can't get any work done on my POS Focus ST until Ford pre-approves the work for reimbursement. It's complete bullshit.

Having a warranty is very overrated. And I thought I would avoid major headaches by going with a new car. LMAO.

DipodomysDeserti > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:36

There have been some cases of FIAT 500 clutches failing prematurely. The one I know about failed at 7k miles and was replaced under warranty.

RosarchII > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:36

His first problem was buying a Dodge. lol

Dean Beyer > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:36

lesson learned: Dodge = crap.

SteveLehto > Arrivederci
08/20/2014 at 15:37

That is exactly why this area remains gray. There are no bright lines. A dealer probably has a decent feel for what a particular car's clutch is good for but it will vary by make, model etc. That's why trying the nice approach is such a good idea. If you are close, the dealer might feel like going to bat for you.

SteveLehto > RosarchII
08/20/2014 at 15:38

Yours is not the first response to suggest this.

SteveLehto > Dean Beyer
08/20/2014 at 15:38

Several people have floated this hypothesis.

GasMoney > Steve
08/20/2014 at 15:38

Chrysler will probably never own themselves for an extended period of time again. On the other hand my mother has a Journey(Made in Mexico) and she loves it.

StevenG > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:39

Sure, but it would be enough to sour me on the brand for life.

toecutter (so grey, I gotta wear shades) > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:39

It also helps if you're a repeat customer, either with car purchases or by having service done there at the dealer (even if it's just oil changes). I've been a twenty-plus year customer with my Toyota dealer and they've done a number of favors for me.

SteveLehto > StevenG
08/20/2014 at 15:40

Yes, I hear you. I have had clients who swore off a brand because of something like this - after they had been brand loyal for decades. Clients who worked for the company that denied their claim. Guys who worked at the plants that assembled the cars, I kid you not. Now, THAT'S pissed off.

sskamboj > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:41

I recently had the clutch go out on my '13 VW GTI with only 21k and had it replaced fully under warranty. Granted, they did the full tear down and investigation to see what exactly caused the problem and found that the pressure plate spring had broken.

They didn't give me any fuss or headache about costs. While I do believe that sometimes user error can cause these things to happen, it's up to the dealer's service department to do a full investigation and see how wide spread the issue has been. I was lucky enough that the tech working on my car actually did go out and do the research and saw that other cars actually had this same exact problem.

My point is that it doesn't sound like the dealer or even the service guys did that before just blatantly denying the claim. Good service departments are pretty hard to come by nowadays, unfortunately.

SteveLehto > toecutter (so grey, I gotta wear shades)
08/20/2014 at 15:41

Yes, and that is always something to drop into the conversation with the managers and the factory reps if you get to talk to them - how many cars you and your family buy and how often you are there spending money. Good dealers are very aware of the value of those relationships.

RX > deekster_caddy
08/20/2014 at 15:42

I bought a new RX8 after having approximately 15 minutes experience driving stick, I taught my wife on that car, and auto crossed it. So that clutch had quite a bit of abuse. Was still fine at 100k when the rotary went. The notion that the cluch is a normal wear item like brakes, tires, batteries, etc is pretty outdated.

Just wear your damn mask... > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:42

You are right about this being a grey area. 11k to me at least is an odd mileage for a manufacturing defect to show up on something like a clutch. A clutch is a pretty simple mechanism; there isn't much to go wrong if driven properly. If there is a material defect it will manifest itself rather quickly.

Full of the sound of the Gran Fury, signifying nothing. > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:43

Dad's new E-class had 6,000 miles when the front tires needed to be replaced. Overly aggressive driving, they said, which, if you know my dad, couldn't be further from the truth. It's a base model E, not an AMG, fer chrissakes...

One year later the dealer discovers a defective steering rack, and covered it under warranty (along with another pair of tires). It seems they never want to let facts get in the way of their beliefs and opinions.

SteveLehto > sskamboj
08/20/2014 at 15:43

That is true - about good service departments. One thing I do know is that many people in the community will know which dealer have the good engine guys or the good body shop etc. Not all shops are created equal.

ED9man2 > deekster_caddy
08/20/2014 at 15:43

You'd be surprised, a real moron driving can easily waste a clutch in less than 1000 miles.

StevenG > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:44

Amatuer, I am admitted to bars in every state in this nation. I am pretty good tipper too.

/Try the veal, I will be here all week.

SteveLehto > Full of the sound of the Gran Fury, signifying nothing.
08/20/2014 at 15:45

Some of it is understandable too. They see cars all day long and many of them are abused. They spend a minute talking to you and a few looking at your car. Knee jerk reaction is that you are just like the others. Another reason to get to know your dealer when you find a good one.

Dolemite > Ark
08/20/2014 at 15:46

I had a problem with my car (bought new from the dealership), where the window trim seemed to be cracking/drying out faster than the rubber anywhere else on the car (after 2 years, it looked like it was 8 years old). I showed it to the dealer, and they said it must have been something I'd done. All I did was wash it with top-notch car soap like Meguires. After that, I started putting trim protectant on it, but it didn't seem to help much, and the dealer said using that stuff did it, despite the fact I didn't use it until it was already cracked. Fine, don't pay for it. Of course when I buy a car next time, I won't buy from you, but a competitor.

SteveLehto > StevenG
08/20/2014 at 15:46

You're doing it wrong if they let you back in once you've been there before.

High Road > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:47

It's a $16K, American made piece of shit car; it doesn't get any cheaper. He's lucky he got 11K miles out it. I mean come on, you get what you pay for. Not too mention, anyone with judgement poor enough to buy a Dart, probably doesn't know how to properly drive a stick. It reminds me of an old Leno joke about him standing in a crosswalk and some guy in an AMC Pacer gives him the go-ahead wave to cross, and Leno's like, "No, no, you go first, I insist, because obviously you don't make very good decisions". (It was funnier when he told it).

Autojunkie > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:47

Fuck that! I emailed Marchionne directly, along with several other Chrysler executives and directors, my local congressman and senator, a couple of local news outlets, and few other people that I thought were important. I put their email addresses in the carbon copy of my main email to customer service. In my email, I was polite, but to the point of:

- what happened

- why

- what I want

Amazingly, it worked. Customer service will get you nowhere unless you push beyond them. You just have to know what to do and how to do it. I've been doing this sort of thing for over 10 years and 99% of the time I get what I want or a very good negotiation in my favor.

Oh! I forgot to mention that my car was well out of warranty (2001 MY w/ over 100K miles). I did this particular action back in 2009. They paid for everything. Customer service initially offered me nothing.

MHunter905 > Ark
08/20/2014 at 15:48

I am at 254,000 kms on the original clutch and its still good. The Dart's clutch must have been defective or the guy beat the hell out of it since it was new. I know it is possible to kill a clutch very very quickly as i have witnessed once before (I didn't do it I swear).

UKPDXWRX > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:48

My Subaru had the third gear syncro go out during the drivetrain warranty. They replaced it of course but they also went ahead and threw in a fresh clutch and pressure-plate while they had the transmission off, free of charge - at over 30k miles.

So Dodge can take a hike here.

blmlozz > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:48

Steve's 100% right here. None of you, not a single one, knows the self-proclaimed innocent party here. Did you personally ride home with him or her every night to verify their obviously indisputable claims that ' surely It wasn't me!'

no, you haven't, and yet, you automatically think, corporation bad/ simple guy good.

Well, the facts of the matter are(and facts, not opinion, is what counts in court), defects are far more rare than user abuse.

The outcome was pretty good, the customer ended up on the better side of the deal, and I can guarantee the few hundred dollars expended is pennies compared to the thousands (or tens of thousands)in costs it would have come to to end up with a (likely) more negative out come. If he still doesn't like that, it's a free country, sell the car and buy something else.

PatBateman > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:49

I always operate by the mantra, "Ask and ye might receive."

SteveLehto > High Road
08/20/2014 at 15:49

Well, that's a little harsh. If they build it and advertise that it has a warranty, then I think the buyer is entitled to some recourse.

I admit I would love to speak to the geniuses who signed off on the slate of AMC cars from the late 70s. Gremlin, Pacer, Matador . . . each uglier than the last. I liked the AMX but that doesn't make up for the rest of them.

SteveLehto > UKPDXWRX
08/20/2014 at 15:50

Wow. [That is all.]

SteveLehto > blmlozz
08/20/2014 at 15:52

And never underestimate the time and frustration of waiting out the time from filing suit until you get a resolution. Sometimes it is best to just get it done and move on.

SirPoopyPants > SteveLehto
08/20/2014 at 15:55

Well, if I had a decent lawyer and could hit the dealership/"Chrysler" with my attorney's fees, I'd personally be confident. I'm a attorney myself and have owned 11 different cars with manual transmissions. There is no way that anyone who isn't either racing or doing burnouts constantly is going to burn out a clutch in 11k miles.

I think the soonest I had one go was 75-80k on an E46 BMW that I drove like a complete jackass (read: burnouts & hooning) and taught myself how to drive stick with.

HeyYouGuys > Ark
08/20/2014 at 15:59

You must have missed the part where the writer explicitly pointed out that the dealer does not pay for one bit of your warranty- the manufacturer does. It's up to THEM what's covered, and your dealer has no say in the matter.